Hello and welcome back to Equity, a podcast about the business of startups, where we unpack the numbers and nuance behind the headlines.

This is our Wednesday show, where we niche down to a single person, think about their work and unpack the rest. This week, Natasha interviewed Cleo’s chief business officer and former CEO, SJ Sacchetti. We spoke about nearly every theme most founders and chief executives are too scared to talk about: ego, setting boundaries, stepping down and becoming a “statistic” and why a company needs to succeed without you. We talk about failure – or the fear of it, at least – and really, where things go wrong when we talk about how success is celebrated in tech.

It’s a profound episode, and I’m jittery to have you all listen to it.

As always, I’ll be back with the full Equity crew on Friday, but you can keep up with us in the meantime on Twitter @EquityPod.

Equity drops at 10:00 a.m. PT every Monday and at 7:00 a.m. PT on Wednesdays and Fridays, so subscribe to us on Apple Podcasts, Overcast, Spotify and all the casts. TechCrunch also has a great show on crypto, a show that interviews founders, one that details how our stories come together and more!